Well, [unclear]. I dislike putting people on the spot, but goddamn it, they’ve got to learn to face up to this stuff. [Unclear.] It’s good for them.

[Unclear.]

Good for them. Well, they’re good men. They’re good men. But goddamn it, they—I really believe, I mean, I don’t—I think George [P. Shultz] is learning, but [James D.] Jim [Hodgson] is taking time—I really believe that they think these sons of bitches are honest![note 1] George P. Shultz was secretary of labor from January 1969 to July 1970, director of the Office of Management and Budget from June 1970 to May 1972, and secretary of the treasury from May 1972 to May 1974. James D. Hodgson was secretary of labor from July 1970 to February 1973.

Yeah, they do. They did. They don’t now.

Did this convince them? I don’t think that I convinced them. Weren’t they convinced by the goddamn release?

I got them all in there at 7:00 and read them the statements. We had done some digging all night. I’d had one of my staff making phone calls to BLS people and recording the phone calls. And I gave it back to them. And when they saw what the BLS people were actually saying, they just caved in. They know now. There’s no question. They know that they scuttled—

How’d you do the phone calls? Make it appear some newspaper?

Yes, sir. Time magazine.

Time magazine?

Well, I had one of my men call this time and talk to them.

And who’d they talk to? You get the names?

Couldn’t get Gold—oh, yeah, we got all the names. Couldn’t get [Harold] Goldstein.[note 2] Harold Goldstein was assistant commissioner of labor statistics. But it was very clear from talking to these fellows, which I—

And they all talked?

Every one of them. Every one! And every one of them said, “Don’t listen to anybody in this business except Goldstein.” And when I told them that, that did it. [Unclear.]

You tell [Geoffrey H.]Moore that?

Well, Moore wasn’t there when I told—I told Shultz [unclear]—[note 3] Geoffrey H. Moore was commissioner of labor statistics from March 1969 to January 1973.

They said don’t listen to anybody but Goldstein? Well, listen, are they all Jews over there?

Every one of them. Well, a couple of exceptions. Oh, Jesus.

See my point?

Gordowsky [President Nixon acknowledges] and Levine and you just go right down the damn list. You know goddamn well they’re out, I mean, they’re out to kill us. Now, the trouble is—

See, I never—

—this son of a bitch Moore [President Nixon acknowledges] is sitting there this morning saying, “Well, I don’t know whether these figures show improvement or not.” Well, God Almighty! Shultz and Hodgson and this fellow who works for Shultz is a smart guy.

With a little hook. [Unclear.]

No, Julius Shiskin.[note 4] Nixon appointed Julius Shiskin commissioner of labor statistics. He served from July 1973 to October 1978. He’s Jewish also, but he’s—

Well, goddamn it, there’s some damn good Jewish—[Colson attempts to interject] [unclear] on our side. Kissinger’s [unclear] [Colson acknowledges] got. [Unclear] you know, he just happened to be a good one.