I had a couple visits with the Vice President [Spiro T. Agnew] since he’s been back from his trip.[note 1] Spiro T. Agnew was vice president of the United States, January 1969 to October 1973. And we’re trying to get this Office of Intergovernmental Relations thing worked around. You know, at one time, he wanted all intergovernmental relations to be his thing. He’s now off of that. And he’s decided that there should be a director of an Office of Intergovernmental Relations who can nominally report to him, but he should not be the figurehead on intergovernmental relations because of the hostility of Democratic governors toward him. He’s too partisan and he agreed with that. So, that’s a shift.

Well, sure, we’ve got some people [unclear]. [Ehrlichman acknowledges.] He’s a—really a very unlucky son of a bitch anyway. I can imagine what Agnew [unclear].

That’s it. Get it [unclear]—

[Unclear]—

And Agnew gets end-runned—they end run him, you see. They go to other people around here. And that’s difficult for Agnew, because that’s a loss of face. So we’ve agreed that we’ll press to get somebody to go in there. And he’s coming back with them and I think he’s reasonably [unclear] despite the liaison [unclear] did exist. It doesn’t seem to exist now. It did exist; as a matter of fact, we talked about how it was going to affect him, and so on. And so I think we’re on a pretty good footing with him.

Just a damn hard thing, John, to know how to handle. Just because he’s got lots of things to do, but all the things he enjoys doing is, frankly, in committees.

[Unclear] suspect that’s right.

I don’t think that he much cares about doing anything. [Ehrlichman acknowledges.] I think he would enjoy sitting in and helping make decisions. That he cannot do except in the Cabinet and the [National] Security Council. He can’t. [Ehrlichman acknowledges.] I just don’t know.

Well, but he is concerned about his prerogatives. He’s concerned about being kept informed.

He will be.

And so we keep him informed and we can set up a procedure for doing it. [Unclear] and so forth.

What is your feeling about [unclear] the Senate?

Yeah, I’m—

Has he [unclear]?

I don’t see it. I’ve tried—I’ve probably got a blind spot on that, and—

You’ve talked to enough people, though, [unclear]?

Well, no, I can’t say I have.

But you did have a [unclear]?

I did do kind of a—kind of an internal thing. And in comparing him with [John B.] Connally, is that having an alternative in sight[note 2] John B. Connally was a Democratic governor of Texas, 1963–1969; and secretary of the treasury, February 1971 to May 1972.—

You have a hell of a problem.

I—yeah, I think this is—

Connally is so easy to work with. He’s got his ego and everything, but he goddamn runs with you on the [unclear]. But on the other hand, if you inform him, you can work it out—it’s worked out. [Ehrlichman acknowledges throughout.] It’s like smooth as glass.

Yeah. And he . . . that’s right. He wants to be kept informed. He wants to be kept in the play. He wants to keep his prerogatives. But that’s—I don’t object to that—I think that’s right. I think he should. At the same time, he’s a doer. And he knows how to do things and follow through [unclear] the press.

I had Connally succeed [unclear] to State. [Ehrlichman acknowledges.] Now, he . . . that would be—

[Unclear.]

He’d run the State Department. [Ehrlichman acknowledges.] We’d finally have that goddamn department run.

He’d be great.

And, of course, he’d be a monumental figure. Rather than having him vice president.

Sure.

He himself raises the question of what the Christ the vice president—he knows it’s a [Ehrlichman acknowledges] very risky dang job. It’s hard to find a niche for one. My own feeling is that it, just sort of thinking it through, if we did have a [unclear], if he were vice president, it would really be a case where Agnew, if I were discussing, let’s say, the China thing, [unclear] I’d have him in practically all the time.

What about giving him a portfolio?

When? Now?

When he’s vice president.

Make him secretary of state? [Unclear] run down and preside over the Senate? The constitutional duties are nothing, really, nothing.

That’s right.

That is another possibility.

I think, just kind of winging it.