Lyndon B. Johnson, William R. Anderson, John W. McCormack, and Frank Thompson Jr. on 23 July 1965


Transcript

Edited by Guian A. McKee, with Kieran K. Matthews and Marc J. Selverstone

On 22 July 1965, the House of Representatives passed the Economic Opportunity Amendments of 1965 with a 245–158 roll call vote. The House bill, which received 19 more votes than the original Economic Opportunity Act a year before, increased funding for the War on Poverty and removed some of the controls that southern Democrats had placed on federal officials in the 1964 legislation. In this conversation with Speaker of the House John W. McCormack [D–Massachusetts], President Johnson appeared to refer, briefly, to the previous day’s victory. McCormack is nearly inaudible, as are Rep. Frank Thompson Jr. [D–New Jersey] and Rep. William R. Anderson [D–Tennessee], who joined in later in the conversation.

President Johnson

Hello?[note 1] The Presidential Recordings Program revised the following section of text in 2021 for inclusion in The LBJ Telephone Tapes, a project produced by the Miller Center in partnership with the Lyndon B. Johnson Presidential Library to commemorate the library's 50th anniversary.

John W. McCormack

Yes, Mr. President.

President Johnson

Mr. Speaker, glad to hear you.

McCormack

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Thank you.

McCormack

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Yes, sir. He told me he was the man. He said he was going to do it Tuesday.

McCormack

[Unclear], yeah. Yeah, he told me that he [unclear]. [Unclear.] Today I tried to get them to vote, but he told me he was talking till ten o’clock last night.

President Johnson

I told him you were bragging on him, the great chairman. And that now they’ve got it 8–0, he oughtn't to stop around there, and get ready for that 21 days, so we can pass that. And I had the Senate in this morning, and [Michael J. “Mike”] Mansfield [D–Montana] and [Everett M.] Dirksen [R–Illinois] both said that they’d check and try to get it reported on the calendar over there, waiting for you to come over.[note 2] Michael J. “Mike” Mansfield was a U.S. senator [D–Montana] from January 1953 to January 1977, and Senate Majority Leader from January 1961 to January 1977. Everett M. Dirksen was a U.S. senator [R–Illinois] from January 1951 until his death in September 1969, and Senate Minority Leader from January 1959 to September 1969.

McCormack

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

I told him that in ʼ49. [Mansfield acknowledges.] It was on his national origin.

McCormack

Yep. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

Well, next thing you make—

McCormack

Listen, [unclear]

President Johnson

You call up that dairy out there, and get ahold of Howard [W. “Judge”] Smith while he’s milking that cow, and tell him that we have got a few hundred coming in here with some of Jack Valenti’s parents and his grandpas, out in here, and it’s not going to hurt him one damn bit, out of 200 million people, to let a few hundred come back and unite their families.[note 3] Howard W. “Judge” Smith was a U.S. representative [D–Virginia] from March 1931 to January 1967, and chair of the House Rules Committee from January 1955 to January 1967. Jack Valenti was a partner at Weekley and Valenti, a political and advertising consulting agency, from 1952 to 1963; special assistant to the president from 1963 to 1966; and president of the Motion Picture Association of America from 1966 to 2004. And that this is something we got to have a rule on, and tell that bunch of Democrats, those [unclear] Democrats, they’re supposed to get together if we want to move this thing, so that they won’t let it get mixed up—

McCormack

Yeah, well, [unclear] got a problem [unclear].

President Johnson

Well, but they could give us a rule if they want to.

McCormack

They can if they want to.

President Johnson

John [A.] Young [D–Texas] and that crowd, they can vote for a rule.[note 4] John A. Young was a U.S. representative [D–Texas] from 1957 to 1979.[note 5] End of 2021 revisions. And our Democrats—

McCormack

[Unclear] my understanding is [unclear].

President Johnson

I called him this morning, and got his message. I called him at eight o’clock; he wasn’t at home. I finally located him at the airport, told him you told me what a good job he’s done, that I wanted him to know I was grateful, and I want to see him when he got back.

McCormack

Fine.

President Johnson

So I got him at the airport while you were still asleep.

McCormack

[Unclear]

President Johnson

You hear what I said? I said, “I got him at the airport at eight o’clock while you were still asleep!”

McCormack

I wasn’t sleeping. [President Johnson laughs heartily.] [Unclear.]

President Johnson

Well, I don’t either. I don’t either. I’m up.

McCormack

I know, but I wasn’t the one in the country.

President Johnson

[Laughs.] Well, you’re going to come down there and see that country, though. You’re going to—I know you don’t like these airplanes, but I’m going to fly you and Mrs. [M. Harriet] McCormack down there and show you that God’s country, and you’ll see what you’ve been missing all these years.[note 6] M. Harriet McCormack was the wife of John W. McCormack since 1920. How’s old George [J.] Feldman?[note 7] George J. Feldman was chief counsel for the House Committee on Astronautics and Space Exploration; a director of Communications Satellite Corporation from 1962 to 1965; U.S. ambassador to Malta from 1965 to 1967; and U.S. ambassador to Luxembourg from 1967 to 1969. Did he ever—

McCormack

I just had lunch with him!

President Johnson

Well, did he appreciate being an ambassador?

McCormack

Oh, yeah. [Unclear.] He had a good time over there. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

Well, he did a hell of a good job over there, they told me.

McCormack

Yes, he was [unclear].

President Johnson

[J. William] Bill Fulbright [D–Arkansas] says—[note 8] J. William “Bill” Fulbright was a U.S. senator [D–Arkansas] from January 1945 to December 1974, and chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee from January 1959 to December 1974.

McCormack

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

I’m going to let you and Harriet have the tea. George and I’ll have something else.

McCormack

[Laughs.] [Unclear]

President Johnson

Do you and [Samuel T. “Sam”] Rayburn still have that deal, you know, where he gives you his cigar, and you give him his other presents?[note 9] Samuel T. “Sam” Rayburn was a U.S. representative [D–Texas] from March 1913 until his death in November 1961; Speaker of the House from September 1940 to November 1961; and one of Lyndon Johnson’s political mentors.

McCormack

Exactly.

President Johnson

All right, I’ll make a deal with you.

McCormack

Oh, by the way, [unclear].

President Johnson

They tell me Jim slipped a lot.[note 10] “Jim” is unidentified.

McCormack

That’s right.

President Johnson

Harriet told me, I think it was. [Unclear.]

McCormack

By the way, [unclear]. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

[Unclear.]

McCormack

[Unclear.] Now, here’s Frank Thompson [Jr.] [D–New Jersey] to say hello to you.[note 11] Frank Thompson Jr. was a U.S. representative [D–New Jersey] from January 1955 to December 1980, and chair of the House Subcommittee on Libraries and Memorials from 1969 to 1971.

President Johnson

All right.

Frank Thompson Jr.

[Unclear], Mr. President.

President Johnson

Frank, fine, just doing fine. When are we going to get our higher education in?

Thompson

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Well, I don’t know. It’s still in that Rules Committee, isn’t it?

Thompson

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Yeah, good. You all have been really doing a good job on that committee this year. Now, have you got your votes on your Taft-Hartley [bill]? [Lawrence F.] Larry [O’Brien Jr.] tells me you got 220.[note 12] Lawrence F. “Larry” O’Brien Jr. was special assistant to the president for congressional affairs from 1961 to 1965; U.S. postmaster general from November 1965 to April 1968; and chair of the Democratic National Committee from 1968 to 1969 and 1970 to 1972.

Thompson

We have, Mr. President. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

I told the leadership this morning to get ready to take it up. I thought it ought to pass, that I signed up for it. And—

Thompson

[Unclear] anticipate [unclear] five hours, two [unclear].

President Johnson

Wonder how much time did the rule allow? One hour?

Thompson

One hour on each side.

President Johnson

Yeah. And what are you going to do, about two hours on each side?

Thompson

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

That won’t make it go over an extra day, will it?

Thompson

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Yeah.

Thompson

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

OK, well, I’m sure glad to hear you, Frank.

Thompson

Oh, thank you, Mr. President.

President Johnson

You’ve done a good job, and I sure appreciate it.

Thompson

Well, it’s a labor of love and [unclear].

President Johnson

I called him, got him at the airport this morning. You tell the Speaker how he’s way behind me, and he—

Thompson

[Laughs.] I’ll do that!

President Johnson

—tell him I’m seven hours ahead of him. I got him at eight o’clock.

Thompson

Thank you, Mr. President.

President Johnson

Right, bye.

Thompson

Here’s the Speaker.

McCormack

[William R. “Bob”] Bill Anderson [D–Tennessee] is on the phone.[note 13] William R. “Bob” Anderson was commander of the USS Nautilus from 1957 to 1959; an independent gubernatorial candidate in Tennessee in 1962; and a U.S. representative [D–Tennessee] from January 1965 to January 1973. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

Yeah.

McCormack

[Unclear.]

President Johnson

Yes, sir.

McCormack

[Unclear] he had a great war record.

President Johnson

I know it, he’s an admiral.

McCormack

Yes, [unclear].

William R. “Bob” Anderson

Mr. President, how are you, sir?

President Johnson

Good to hear you. Is everything all right in Tennessee?

Anderson

It’s all pretty good, sir.

President Johnson

[E.] Buford Ellington’s doing a good job.[note 14] E. Buford Ellington was the Democratic governor of Tennessee from January 1959 to January 1963 and January 1967 to January 1971, and became director of the Office of Emergency Planning in 1965.

Anderson

Well, I’m glad to hear it. Glad to hear it, sir. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

[Unclear] I’m hearing good reports about you, and you keep up the good work, because Tennessee is one of our better states.

Anderson

Well, that’s [unclear]. [Unclear.]

President Johnson

Trying to keep your Navy from sinking.

Anderson

Well, I’m [unclear].

President Johnson

Thank you, Bill. OK.

Anderson

Thank you.

President Johnson

Bye.

Cite as

“Lyndon B. Johnson, William R. Anderson, John W. McCormack, and Frank Thompson Jr. on 23 July 1965,” Conversation WH6507-06-8374, Presidential Recordings Digital Edition [Lyndon B. Johnson: The War on Poverty, vol. 2, ed. Guian A. McKee] (Charlottesville: University of Virginia Press, 2014–). URL: http://prde.upress.virginia.edu/conversations/4004982